Bonpo Pasang

 

Dorje: What is your name, Meme (Grandpa)?

Bonpo Pasang: My name is Pasang.

Dorje: How old are you?

Pasang: Four times twenty and four.

Dorje: Four times twenty and four?!

Pasang: Yes, 84.

Dorje: Is your family from Milimchim, or did you move here?

Pasang: I am from over there, Bolgang. Originally, I came from Bolgang.

Dorje: So, your family migrated from Bolgang. Did you move here during your time or your father’s time?

Pasang: During my father’s time.

Dorje: With whom did you move here? Your father and mother? You were born over there?

Pasang: Yes, I was born over there.

Dorje: You must have brothers.

Pasang: I had two older brothers; one I have no contact with, and the other died.

Dorje: Was your father also a Bonpo?

Pasang: No, he wasn’t.

Dorje: He wasn’t, but you are?

Pasang: Yes, I learned.

Dorje: Who did you learn from?

Pasang: Meme Chhyaru taught me, along with his son, Meme Temba. Both of them taught me.

Dorje: How old were you when you started learning? Were you still a child?

Pasang: No. It was the year when Dorje, my second son, was born.

Dorje: Were you about 20 years old then?

Pasang: No, not 20, I must have been about 40.

Dorje: Where did you go for your first jatra (pilgrimage)?

Pasang: My first jatra was to Mahadev.

Dorje: When you say Mahadev, do you mean Krejong in Nuwakot (the famous Mahadev temple)?

Pasang: Yes, Krejong.

Dorje: Did you start the journey from Milimchim village?

Pasang: No, I actually started from the shed over there.

Dorje: Where was the shed?

Pasang: In Bolgang.

Dorje: So, you started the journey from Bolgang?

Pasang: Yes, from there.

Dorje: How many days did it take?

Pasang: Normally, it depends on how fast or slow you are. On the first night, we reached the Meme’s place, and then on the second day, we reached the destination.

Dorje: Did you reach Krejong on the second day?

Pasang: Yes.

Dorje: Did you return on the third day?

Pasang: No, we didn’t return on the third day. We got back on the fourth or fifth day. It took two or three days to get back.

Dorje: When do you usually organize a jatra? Is it an annual custom?

Pasang: Every year, on the full moon of Mangshir (a Nepali month).

Dorje: Only on the full moon of Mangshir, or other times as well?

Pasang: Mostly on the full moon of Mangshir.

Dorje: Where else did you organize a jatra?

Pasang: We went twice to Mahadev and once to Fadungdung (a place below Tashithang; a rockface with water dropping down, known as drubchu—the water of realization).

Dorje: Altogether, three times?

Pasang: Yes.

Dorje: There must be other places Bonpos visit for jatra.

Pasang: Other places Bonpos go to are Tsho (referring to Gosainkunda Lake) and Kartik Drupchu in Gyang (another sacred water source near Kutumsang, Nuwakot). There is a drupchu (droplets falling from rocks) in Gyang.

Dorje: Is there any difference in the process or purpose of visiting a drupchu (holy spring) or a tsho (holy lake)?

Pasang: The process and purpose are the same, there is no difference.

Dorje: Who else can participate in a jatra? Does the Bonpo have company during the journey?

Pasang: Villagers accompany the Bonpo, including young males and females, who enjoy these journeys. They sing “Se Bonpo” and dance.

Dorje: Does the Bonpo wear a special attire?

Pasang: Yes, Bonpos have a special attire. They wear miyul.

Dorje: How does that attire look?

Pasang: A thee (scarf around the head) and miyul, which means skirt.

Dorje: Do you play the drum on the way while walking?

Pasang: Yes, I play the drum.

Dorje: Do you play the drum the whole way?

Pasang: Yes, all the way.

Dorje: Are you dancing too?

Pasang: Yes, I have to dance.

Dorje: It must be quite tiring, no?

Pasang: A bit. Not too much. As God carries you all the way, you don’t feel the movement. Going uphill, old ones are surprised. During my first jatra, we started the climb from the valley and only rested at Parakharka, above Tshokambu. Then, without resting anywhere, we reached Meme’s place. We stayed at Meme Bonpo’s place.

Dorje: You mean the Meme Bonpo, who you mentioned as your teacher?

Pasang: Yes, that’s him.

Dorje: What is his name?

Pasang: The older’s name is Chhyaru, and the younger one is Temba.

Dorje: Both of them were teaching you?

Pasang: Yes. They are father and son.

Dorje: When you organized a jatra, with whom did you go? Were you the only Bonpo in the group?

Pasang: When we went to Mahadev, following the lower route, Mingmar, my son, was accompanying me. He was also dressed in Bonpo attire. He took some pictures of the journey.

Dorje: Do Bonpo Lhamus also need to accompany the Bonpo?

Pasang: Lhamu?

Dorje: Yes, Bonpo Lhamu (T. lha mo, “goddess”).

Pasang: Oh, we call them Bumba Lamu. The one who carries the bumba (T. bum pa, jar), yes, she goes with the Bonpo.

Dorje: Does she have to be a young girl?

Pasang: Yes.

Dorje: Why is she needed?

Pasang: Because she is the one who carries God’s bumba.

Dorje: When do you need to organize a jatra? Some people say that, for instance, after completing a retreat, you must organize a jatra. Is that so?

Pasang: Yes, you have to organize one after completing a retreat. When I went to Mahadev, we were preparing for five days after completing the retreat, and then we set out.

Dorje: For how long were you in retreat?

Pasang: One has the right to decide the length of the retreat.

Dorje: After completing your retreat, you prepared for five days to set out for a jatra?

Pasang: Yes.

Dorje: Many people must have participated in the jatra.

Pasang: All young male and female villagers, who love going on jatra, would join. When I started the jatra from there, we counted thirty people at Chhumjaringbu joining and coming with me.

Dorje: You were dancing and singing all the way.

Pasang: It’s like half walking, half dancing and singing.

Dorje: Are there still jatras being organized these days by the villagers?

Pasang: Yes, they still organize them. Every year there is a jatra to Mahadev. Innumerable people come to Mahadev every year. This coming full moon, a jatra is organized in Gyang. People dance on the ground of Gyang where a drupchu is beneath the ground. On the next full moon day, they set out to Mahadev.

Dorje: Is there a set number of Bonpos needed for a jatra?

Pasang: There is no set timing for jatra, it’s up to the individual’s wish.

Dorje: And there’s no set number of Bonpos?

Pasang: No, it’s also our own wish or decision.

Dorje: Is “Se Bonpo Se Se Se,” the song that is usually sung?

Pasang: Yes, that was created by an expert. Originally, it was “So Bonpo So So So,” invented by Shyabru Meme. Later, it was mispronounced as “Se.”

Dorje: Did Shyabru Meme create the song?

Pasang: No, he didn’t. The villagers turned it into a song. Originally, he invented it. I’m related to him, we’re family. He is the brother of my grandfather, in-law to my father.

Dorje: These days, people say “Se Bonpo Se,” but originally it was “So Bonpo So”?

Pasang: Yes, originally it was “So Bonpo So.” Later, people mispronounced it as “Se.”

Dorje: Do you know what “So Bonpo So” means?

Pasang: I don’t know what it means. Originally, it was “So Bonpo So So So,” then it was changed to “Se Bonpo Se Se Se.”

Dorje: Okay. Is this line repeated in every song?

Pasang: Yes, it’s part of every song.

Dorje: Do Bonpos have any books or scriptures?

Pasang: I’ve heard that there are books, but I haven’t seen any yet. I heard there is a Bonpo Monastery behind Swayambhu, and there are books there.

Dorje: Have you visited that place?

Pasang: No, I have not.

Dorje: Were there others learning the Bonpo tradition at the same time as you?

Pasang: Yes, there were. Within my circle of friends, we taught each other. Memes taught us, and we taught the next generation. I heard that Fu-Karpu Dhame Sarki (Fu-Karpu: a person with a white face living in the village) had 5-6 students.

Dorje: Who did you teach? How many people?

Pasang: Nobody learned from me under my guidance. I was in retreat for five days with Dawa Pemba, his son, Meme, and Meme’s nephew in Langtang. Dawa Pemba sponsored the food.

Dorje: So that was a retreat?

Pasang: Yes, we were in retreat.

Dorje: Did you go to jatra after completing it?

Pasang: Not really, but on the way back, we passed Gosainkunda Lake in our jatra attire.

Dorje: Why do Bonpos go on jatra?

Pasang: It’s said that we must go on jatra, visit lakes, pray to Mahadev, and organize jatra after someone becomes a Bonpo.

Dorje: Is it like a pilgrimage?

Pasang: Yes, it is. It is a pilgrimage.

Dorje: Do you know about the statues on Yangri peak?

Pasang: Where is it?

Dorje: On the top of Yangri, right before you reach the top of Ama Yangri, there are two statues, one male and one female, on the sides of the path.

Pasang: That was made by talented people.

Dorje: Is it not made by Bonpos?

Pasang: No, those were made by villagers, not Bonpos or Lamas.

Dorje: Do you know why?

Pasang: I wonder why they were erected. Langragyabsa (Tarkeygyang) people would know.

Dorje: Jatras are full of fun, aren’t they?

Pasang: It depends on the villagers. They choose whether to enjoy it or not. It’s about singing and dancing.

Dorje: Villagers sing and dance, but what do Bonpos do?

Pasang: Bonpos sit. Upon arriving at resting places, they circle around three or five times while dancing, and then they sit down. After some time, they pray.

Dorje: Is it just about praying and dancing?

Pasang: Yes.

Dorje: Thank you, Meme. I think that’s all I wanted to ask. I wanted to learn about jatra, and now I’ve learned a lot.

Pasang: (Silence)